<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">The question is not limited to phones. E.g. you may also update the firmware of your television, see:<br><br><a href="http://openlgtv.org.ru/wiki/index.php/Wiki_index">http://openlgtv.org.ru/wiki/index.php/Wiki_index</a><br>
<br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If I could rely on the fact that the manufacturer/seller would have to rescue me if I accidentally bricked my TV set, I might be more likely to play with the replacing of its firmware. <br>
<br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Regards,<br>Dov<br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 12:47 PM, Shlomo Solomon <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:shlomo.solomon@gmail.com" target="_blank">shlomo.solomon@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Oleg Shalom,<br>
<br>
I'm pretty sure that the link you provided is a "generic"<br>
Samsung warranty (for appliances, TVs, etc) and not specifically for<br>
phones, so that would explain why there's no mention of rooting.<br>
<br>
I do know that the Scailex (official importer) warranty on Galaxy<br>
phones is even more "draconic" than I previously stated. Clause 10<br>
specifically mentions rooting and clause 13 mentions damage caused by<br>
installing apps, without defining how we know there is a "cause and<br>
effect". Here's a link:<br>
<a href="http://www.samsungmobile.co.il/files/docs/tudat_achrayut_pr.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.samsungmobile.co.il/files/docs/tudat_achrayut_pr.pdf</a><br>
<br>
As you correctly stated, we're dealing with Google, Samsung and (in my<br>
case) Pelephone. My kids' phones are guaranteed by Scailex, but I'll be<br>
getting a phone from Pelephone so I'll be interested to see what their<br>
guarantee says.<br>
<br>
Under Israeli law, all electronic goods costing over 150 Shekels must<br>
have at least a 1 year warranty. Here's a link.<br>
<a href="http://www.moital.gov.il/NR/exeres/8D759CFE-E35B-4F44-8642-B5CED0F7429F.htm" target="_blank">http://www.moital.gov.il/NR/exeres/8D759CFE-E35B-4F44-8642-B5CED0F7429F.htm</a><br>
<br>
The exception (according to that link) is intentional damage or<br>
unauthorized use, but I assume there could be a claim that rooting is<br>
"intentional" or "unauthorized" and everyone "knows" that it potentially<br>
causes damage. The law also states that if the provider proves<br>
negligence ("RASHLANUT") he must still repair damage but can demand<br>
payment. Again, who defines if rooting is negligence?<br>
<div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 10:55:46 +0200<br>
Oleg Goldshmidt <<a href="mailto:pub@goldshmidt.org">pub@goldshmidt.org</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> Shlomo Solomon <<a href="mailto:shlomo.solomon@gmail.com">shlomo.solomon@gmail.com</a>> writes:<br>
><br>
> > 4 - Speaking of rooting, I never understood why this voids the<br>
> > warranty. I'm not a lawyer but this needs to be challenged in court.<br>
><br>
> IANAL, either, but I would be interested to know what the *statutory*<br>
> warranty in Israel is. I googled and even searched<br>
> <a href="http://www.consumers.org.il" target="_blank">www.consumers.org.il</a> specifically, but didn't find<br>
> anything... :-( Ponters, anyone?<br>
><br>
> For a non-lawyery explanation read on, or stop here.<br>
><br>
> The "rooting voids warranty" clause that just about every manufacturer<br>
> and provider (the party who you really deal with in most cases, I<br>
> suppose) has does not have a leg to stand on in many<br>
> jurisdictions. Every manufacturer/provider will tell you that your<br>
> warranty is void if you do something 'unauthorized', but what they<br>
> mean is their *voluntary* warranty. They will conveniently forget to<br>
> even mention that there is also a statutory warranty. Oft-mentioned<br>
> is, e.g., the EU Directive 1999/44/CE that says that to void a<br>
> statutory consumer warranty the manufacturer/provider must *prove*<br>
> that the user's actions directly caused the fault. In most cases this<br>
> is far more difficult/expensive for the company than just repairing<br>
> or replacing the device. So is defending the position in a small<br>
> claims court.<br>
><br>
> The usual advice is to 1) not volunteer infomation about rooting - if<br>
> you bricked the device they might be able to figure it out, but they<br>
> are unlikely to go through the trouble (and then prove that this was<br>
> the root cause of the problem) rather than just reflash the ROM; 2)<br>
> make it clear that you know your rights w.r.t. statutory warranties -<br>
> the manufacturer/provider takes a calculated chance that most people<br>
> don't. #2 is advisable even without #1.<br>
><br>
> I think that in the US there also exists a Warranty Act that says that<br>
> the manufacturer/seller must prove the fault was caused by the<br>
> consumer. The actual applicable statute probably depends on the state.<br>
><br>
> So, can anyone point to a source that spells out the Israeli law?<br>
><br>
> > The last time I read a phone warranty I seem to remember that it<br>
> > referred to the warranty being voided if you install unauthorized<br>
> > software. But who defines what is unauthorized? Google? There are<br>
> > tons of apps on Google Play that require root so does that imply<br>
> > that rooting is allowed?<br>
><br>
> You deal with Google, the manufacturer (e.g., Samsung), and the<br>
> provider or seller whom you actually got your phone from. They all<br>
> may have different *voluntary* warranties that may even contradict<br>
> each other.<br>
><br>
> Samsung is a curious case, by the way. It was widely reported that<br>
> they refused to repair Vodafone-branded Galaxies because Vodafone (not<br>
> customer!) installed 'custom firmware' on them. On top of that, Steve<br>
> Kondik (a.k.a. 'Cyanogen') was, until recently, employed by Samsung to<br>
> work on CyanogenMod. The irony...<br>
><br>
> By the way, I don't see anything specifically about rooting in<br>
><br>
> <a href="http://www.samsung.com/il/support/warranty/warrantyInformation.do" target="_blank">http://www.samsung.com/il/support/warranty/warrantyInformation.do</a><br>
><br>
> [Hebrew], but IANAL.<br>
><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
</div></div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">Shlomo Solomon<br>
<a href="http://the-solomons.net" target="_blank">http://the-solomons.net</a><br>
Sent by Claws Mail 3.9.0 - KDE 4.10.2 - LINUX Mageia 3<br>
</font></span><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
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