VERY OT: internet infrastructure - any alternatives to Hot and Bezeq?

[Oleg Goldshmidt]

[Everybody, I tried to respond to Geoff and it turned out to be a long
rant, but maybe there is something here that will help others apply
more pressure on providers when there is a problem. It's VERY OT, but
it does concern providers of relevant services.]

On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 4:38 PM, geoffrey mendelson
<geoffreymendelson at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hot has what they call "buisness class" service. If the outage is regional,
> they can't help you any more than the regular customers, but it it's local.
> they are very different.

Hi Geoff,

I said specifically that I was not experiencing any serious technical
issues. It is not about the latency of their response to outages or
service interruptions. Hot have very serious operational, not
technical, issues, they screw up often, and my problem is that I
cannot resolve any issue - administrative, billing, customer service -
without climbing several rungs up their managerial ladder. The usual
workflow includes several calls to Customer Service (loooong waiting
on the line, etc.), on certain issues I get patched through to
"Customer Relations" (whatever that is, but it is different from
"Customer Service", inaccessible in any direct way, and they never
answer the phone, at least I always lose patience before they do),
then I ask to talk to a manager, then a higher level manager, up to,
e.g., the National Customer Service Manager (or National Technical
Support Manager). In the end, when I get to that level, either the
issue gets resolved or I demand to speak to an even bigger boss, am
told (after a vigorous attempt to dissuade me) that the super-high
manager will be in touch within 24 hours, and then the same National
This-or-That Manager is back on the line within 15 minutes and the
issue is solved.

It *always* gets solved - maybe because I don't call without a good
reason. Whether or not "business class" or "gamer" (is that
conceptually the same?) users have more luck at lower rungs of the
ladder I do not know. By the way, I had more issues with Hot TV (no
longer) than with Internet, and I doubt there is "business class" for
that.

One thing that never got solved for me, by the way, is the fact that
Hot absolutely refuse to provide anything written regarding the terms
of a deal that you negotiate with them. They record phone calls, log
issues in their CRM, whatever, and the customer has absolutely no
verifiable record of what has transpired. I started keeping written
summaries of my conversations with them, logging names, dates,
details, etc., for reference. I do not know whether it will ever help
in case of a dispute.

I hope more people will start demanding written confirmation of the
terms before agreeing to a deal, and refuse to sign up without it, and
not just with Hot. AFAIK (IANAL) oral agreements are binding according
to the Israeli law, but you don't have to agree...

> In plain English Oleg, this is Israel, and you get what you pay for, nothing
> more, and often a lot less. :-(

Nah. Just the opposite - today I had to go through the procedure
described above about something I did *not* pay for and did not intend
to... ;-) The issue arose because "Cutomer Service" (sherut lakochot)
and "Customer Retention" (shimur lakochot) departments had a certain
set of terms in their system, while the mysterious "Customer
Relations" (kishrei lakochot) department had something different on
record, worse for me. Various representatives frankly acknowledged
that yes, I had been repeatedly given the (better) terms by the first
two departments (they have CRM logs and recorded phone calls), but it
did not matter, and the worse terms - that no one had ever mentioned -
applied. Apparently, their interpretation of the law is that
everything you say (or don't say?) on the phone is binding, while
nothing they say ever is.

I had to reach a fairly senior Customer Service manager, talk to her
at length, twice, and in the end demand to speak to *her* boss, and
after that she called me back and said that since I had indeed been
given better terms, repeatedly, everything would be as I insisted
(sounds rather obvious to me...). I requested a fax or a letter or an
email but she said (as usual) that there was absolutely no procedure
for that and she could not do it, but "I had absolutely nothing to
worry about". Huh?... What was the original issue again??

In plain English: this is Israel, do not give up - at some level there
will be someone who will make a decision. I suppose 99% of their
customers give up early, and they count on it and they have a whole
system to wear you out. Don't let them.

> BTW, there has been construction in the neighborhood with someone running
> cable up the street. I don't know if it's HOT upgrading their
> infrastructure, BEZEQ installing NGN, or someone completely different, but
> in the last two weeks I have had several outages, some lasting for hours,
> and both at the same time.

I am actually on Hot's UFI now and I never noticed the change. In
fairness, it's not always bad, at least on the technical level.

-- 
Oleg Goldshmidt | oleg at goldshmidt.org