Help me understand connection to internet: Infrastructure and ISP

[Uri Even-Chen]

On Sat, Jan 29, 2011 at 13:33, Dotan Cohen <dotancohen at gmail.com> wrote:
> Several times I have been caught in the situation in which the
> Infrastructure (Hot in this particular case) and the ISP (012 in this
> particular case) blame each other for the customer not having internet
> access. I need to understand this.
>
> After two weeks of my mother-in-law not having internet access, during
> which 012 blamed Hot and Hot blamed 012, I get there to take care of
> the issue. At Hot they tell me that since the modem lights are fine (4
> lit, one flashing) the problem must be with 012. At 012 they tell me
> that because she connects without a Dialer (as all Linux customers do)
> they cannot trace the problem any further than a superficial check
> which checks out OK. 012 "sees" the modem, so they say the problem
> must be with Hot.
>
> Apparently, the ability to trace problems is the reason that Windows
> users must use a Dialer. Furthermore, at 012 they inform me that it is
> Hot, not 012, that is providing the internet outside because there is
> no dialer. They say that they gave Hot "permission" to connect me
> directly to the internet this way. So if Hot can provide connections
> out, then why do we need ISPs at all? I notice that no other nation in
> Europe has this Infrastructure/ISP dichotomy.
>
> Furthermore, the next time that there is a problem how can I check if
> the issue is with the infrastructure or with the ISP?

1. I used both Bezeq and Hot and I prefer Bezeq. Hot's service is
really terrible. I'm currently connected with Bezeq and Bezeq
International, and I use Gmail + Google Apps as my email provider (not
Bezeq International).

2. The law in Israel forbids Bezeq and Hot from connecting people to
the Internet without using ISP, since they are both monopolies. You
need to have two companies - either Bezeq or Hot + an ISP. But you can
make a deal with an ISP to pay for Bezeq or Hot - that's what I am
doing with Bezeq International.

3. I'm using Windows with a dialer to connect to the Internet. If you
use a router you can configure the router to dial up for you. I really
don't know how you can connect without a dialer.

4. When you use a dialer, if you can't connect you get an error
message. Tech support people can understand this error message to see
where is the problem. You also have lights in your modem, they are
also used to track problems. You can contact either your ISP tech
support or your infrastructure - I usually call ISP first.

5. I know Bezeq had once options to connect with an ISP without
opening an account - you pay per minute but it's very expensive and I
don't recommend doing it. Even then when I had technical problems and
called Bezeq, they told me to call the tech support of my ISP.

6. Maybe Hevrat Hashmal will start competing with Bezeq and Hot, then
we will have 3 companies which means more competition - prices will go
down and speed & service will improve.

7. An ideal state will be that a company will not need permission from
the government (ministry of communications) to connect people to the
Internet (or to phone & fax). Then we can have hundreds of companies
with competition - prices will go down and speed & service will
improve a lot. But if you live far away from the center you will have
less options. Still I think this is the best solution. Anyone wants to
change the law?...

8. Next time don't wait two weeks. Switch to Bezeq.

9. By the way, by giving Hot "permission" to connect you to the
Internet, I think you must have an account with an ISP, pay the ISP
and you are using the ISP - but directly without a dialer. If you
check your IP address you will probably see that you are connected via
ISP (012.net).

Good luck!

Uri Even-Chen
Mobile Phone: +972-50-9007559
E-mail: uri at speedy.net
Website: http://www.speedy.net/